Eurobasket had the pleasure of sitting with Montepaschi Siena superstar - Bobby Brown (188-PG-84, college: CS Fullerton)
1. What kind of man is Bobby Brown in private life? I am A hard-working man, family guy. I miss my family a lot, I talk with them a LOT, I think I am positive guy, I love to laugh, I love to be around people, IM A PEOPLE PERSON JUST A FUN LOVING GUY.
2. Do you like Italian lifestyle? The country and the people? Obviously, I like it a lot. I like this city, also other: Florence, Rome. The food here is amazing, I love Italian food. Shopping here is great. Life in Italy is real good taking the countries I played in this is one of the top.
3. In Montepaschi Siena you replaced GRANDE Bo McCalebb, who won Euroleague Alphonso Ford Throphy last season. Was it a big challenge for you? Yeah, definitely it was a big challenge when I come here. My agent told me before I came here: U know U are going to Siena replacing a good player Bo McCalleb, you have to fill those shoes, are U ready for this challenge? And I told them I was, we made the deal complete. I came here, I tried to play hard, try to be consistent and help the team win. So far, things have been going good.
4. Few weeks ago U had opportunity to play against Bo, and both you and your team played better than him and Montepaschi. What was your teams attitude to that game? And what was your approach? It was a big motivation for us to go there and play in tough environment and try to win. We know all the things as far as coaching, they were understanding both, switching teams We came out victorious, it was a big win for us. We were happy and pround. I think it was a big motivation for everybody to try win this game.
5. You have played for Polish Champions Asseco Prokom Gdynia in 2010, how do you recall this period? It wasnt really successful season for U, was it? Definitely, it wasnt good season for me. It was a tough one for me that season or half a season I played. my euroleague experience wasnt so great. But I think it motivated me to prove everybody to get back to that level, and show people who complained. You know when I left there, I cleared my mind and said I wanna be a complete player and show people I can play this game and I can play on this level. That was my motivation.
6. Few weeks ago U have been to Gdynia again. How did it feel like? I felt good going back to Gdynia. I've been playing for a while since that happened and I think I let it all out on the court and I tried to win the game as much as possible. That was definitely motivational game for me given the situation I was in. and that was fine.
7. Is there anything you particularly miss from Poland? Not really. There was freezing cold there. But I miss some of Polish teammates I kind of miss there were some good guys, they showed me around the city and are definitely good friends of mine.
8. How would you summarize your time in NBA? In which team have U felt the best? My NBA experience was amazing. It was the best job Ive ever had. NBA is a like the best job ever. I get to be at home and play in front of my family in LA. But the best experience was when I played was New Orleans. We had a great coach, a balanced guy, he showed me the ropes, taught me lot of stuff on how to be complete point guard on and off the court, maturity things, it's definitely being like brothers for me. But I have to say New orleans was the best experience.
9. European basketball is very different than American, isnt it? Which style do you prefer? I prefer NBA style. There is a lot more room to operate as far as a point guard. It's easier for guards like myself to create more than in European game.
10. Uve been chosen MVP of the week three times this season, U scored 41 points against Fenerbahce. There are some gossips that U will go back to NBA after this season. Is there any chance for it? Well have to see in summer. If there is a chance for me to go back to NBA that would be great for me and my family, but if there is a great chance for me come back play on a Euroleague team or come back to Siena, that would be great as well. I will have to see what happens in the summertime. So far, its looking ok for both situations.
11. What do you do in your spare time? What are your passions? Spare time I sleep a lot, I eat a lot, and I am watching a lot of movies. I have a Play station 3 but I really dont play it that much. Usually just watching music, surfing the web, do some online shopping, but mainly sleeping a lot.
12. Your favorite team? Basketball team I really dont have a favorite team, I follow all my buddies that play different teams.
13. Movie? My favorite movie right now it Dark night rises The new Batman movie. I watched it again for the fourth time last night.. it's pretty good.
14. What kind of music do listen to? I listen to all music alternative, hip-hop, rap,R&B, I dont listen country music, but I will allow it a bit. I listen to all genres.
15. U play with no 6 on ur shirt. Is it your favorite number? Does this number have any meaning for U ? Yeah, It does. My first professional number in Berlin, and we won championship this time. So I got It again and hopefully we'll win championship again. I also had it in NBA as well, but it's definitely because it's my first professional number. My favorite number is number 3, but they didn't have it here.
16. Who is your idol on the court? And out of the court? Ben Davis, he's retired now. when he played he was my idol. I grew up watching him playing in LA. And definitely playing pick-up and 1-on-1 with him was a big help for me. He's my idol. Out of court my dad, hes been there for me since I was a little kid, since I was born. He showed me the difference between the right and wrong, respecting people. Just being an adult, being respectable kid growing up. He showed me the ropes, he taught me a lot and he's always been one of my big fans him and my mum that's who I look up to.
Nando De Colo claims Euroleague weekly honour - 1 day ago
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French Nando De Colo (196-SG-87) put on an extraordinary performance in the last round for league's leader CSKA and that's him to receive a Eurobasket.com Player of the Week award for round 18. The 29-year old shooting guard had the game-high 26 points adding four rebounds and five assists for CSKA in his team's victory, helping them to crush Brose Bask. (#12, 7-11) with 21-point margin 85-64. It allowed CSKA to consolidate first place in the Euroleague. They would have been even better i... [read more]
French Nando De Colo (196-SG-87) put on an extraordinary performance in the last round for league's leader CSKA and that's him to receive a Eurobasket.com Player of the Week award for round 18. The 29-year old shooting guard had the game-high 26 points adding four rebounds and five assists for CSKA in his team's victory, helping them to crush Brose Bask. (#12, 7-11) with 21-point margin 85-64. It allowed CSKA to consolidate first place in the Euroleague. They would have been even better if they hadn't lost a few games earlier this season. CSKA has a very solid 14-4 record, but they cannot be too comfortable about keeping top position. In the team's last game De Colo had a remarkable 88.9% from 2-point range. He has many years of experience at CSKA, through which he has constantly improved. De Colo has impressive league stats. He is in league's top in points (2nd best: 19.9ppg) and averages solid 53.7% FGP and 46.2% from behind 3-point line.
The second most remarkable performance in last round's games was 26-year old American point guard Mike James (185-PG-90) of Panathinaikos. James impressed basketball fans with 25 points and 2 assists. Bad luck as Panathinaikos lost that game 63-84 to slightly higher-ranked Fenerbahce (#5, 11-7). This loss caused Panathinaikos to drop to 6th position in the standings. His team lost some distance to top teams. But 10-8 record is not bad and everything may still change. James is a newcomer at Panathinaikos and it seems he did not have too much trouble to become one of team's leaders.
The third best performed player last round was Brazilian Vitor Faverani (212-C-88) of FC Barcelona (#9). Faverani scored 18 points and grabbed eight rebounds. He was a key player of FC Barcelona, leading his team to a 89-78 win against Anadolu Efes (8-10). The chances of FC Barcelona ranking at the top of the league, however are very questionable as they have already lost 10 games, recording just eight victories. With bigger assistance of his teammates, Faverani could help FC Barcelona to bring them higher in the standings. The season just started for Faverani as he played only first game. But it already looks like he can be team's leader.
Other top performing players last week: 4. Artsiom Parakhouski (211-C-87) of Unics - 13 points and 8 rebounds 5. Gustavo Ayon (207-C/F-85) of Real Madrid - 11 points, 2 rebounds and 4 assists 6. Andrew Goudelock (190-G-88) of Maccabi T-A - 19 points, 5 rebounds and 2 assists 7. Brad Wanamaker (193-G-89) of Darussafaka - 16 points, 7 rebounds and 5 assists 8. Sinan Guler (192-SG-83) of Galatasaray - 17 points, 4 rebounds and 6 assists 9. Krunoslav Simon (197-G/F-85) of EA7 Armani - 19 points, 3 rebounds and 5 assists 10. Nicolo Melli (205-PF-91) of Brose Bask. - 15 points, 5 rebounds and 3 assists
The Player of the week is chosen based on efficiency calculation, but also including game result, importance of the game, if played recorded double-double/triple-double, etc. The efficiency formula is a combination of various formulas used by different basketball organizations/leagues. We got involved many basketball scouts and journalists to assure it's accuracy. The formula: 1.5*PTS + 3* (REB+AST+ST+BL-TO) - 2*BSAG - 4*PF + 3*PFRV + 4* (2FGPM+3FGPM) + 1.5*FTM - 3* (2FGPA-2FGPM) - 3* (3FGPA-3FGPM) - (FTA-FTM)
Olympiacos - Baskonia 92-62 An exciting game between Top Four teams was played in Athens. Third ranked Greek Olympiacos faced 4th ranked Spanish Baskonia. Host Olympiacos (13-5) smashed guests from Vitoria (11-7) 92-62. The game was mostly controlled by Olympiacos. Baskonia managed to win fourth quarter 19-16. But it was not enough to take a lead and get a victory that evening. The best player for the winners was Vassilis Spanoulis (193-82, agency: BeoBasket) who scored 12 points and 7 a... [read more]
An exciting game between Top Four teams was played in Athens. Third ranked Greek Olympiacos faced 4th ranked Spanish Baskonia. Host Olympiacos (13-5) smashed guests from Vitoria (11-7) 92-62. The game was mostly controlled by Olympiacos. Baskonia managed to win fourth quarter 19-16. But it was not enough to take a lead and get a victory that evening. The best player for the winners was Vassilis Spanoulis (193-82, agency: BeoBasket) who scored 12 points and 7 assists. Forward Kostas Papanikolaou (206-90) chipped in 12 points and 7 rebounds. Four Olympiacos players scored in double figures. At the other side the best for losing team was Hungarian Adam Hanga (199-89, agency: Octagon Europe) who recorded 11 points and 8 rebounds and American point guard Shane Larkin (180-92, college: Miami, FL) added 12 points respectively. The winner was already known earlier in the game, so both coaches allowed to play the bench players saving starting five for next games. Olympiacos have a solid four-game winning streak. Defending Greek champion moved-up to second place, which they share with Real Madrid. Baskonia at the other side keeps the fourth position with seven games lost. They share it with Fenerbahce. Olympiacos is looking forward to face Armani Milano (#15) on the road in the next round which should be another easy win for them. Baskonia will play against Crvena Zvezda (#8) and is hoping to prove to their fans that this time they can win. Top scorers: Olympiacos: K.Papanikolaou 12+7reb+2ast, G.Printezis 12+3reb+1ast, V.Spanoulis 12+2reb+7ast, E.Green 11+4reb, E.Mantzaris 10+2reb+1ast, K.Birch 9+7reb Baskonia: S.Larkin 12+2reb+2ast, A.Hanga 11+8reb+1ast, R.Beaubois 9+2ast, C.Budinger 8+4reb+1ast, K.Tillie 7+2reb+2ast, R.Freire Luz 5+3reb+1ast
There was no surprise in Kaunas where 13th ranked Lithuanian Zalgiris (6-12) were defeated by second ranked Spanish Real Madrid (13-5) 74-59. The guests were tied after three quarters but managed to speed up in last quarter eventually winning the game. Real Madrid dominated on the defensive end, holding Zalgiris to just 6 points in fourth quarter. Their players were unselfish on offense dishing 25 assists. Liberian-American power forward Othello Hunter (203-86, college: Ohio St., agency: David Lee Services) notched 14 points and 6 rebounds to lead the effort and Sergio Llull (190-87) supported him with 8 points and 8 assists. Even 11 points and 7 rebounds by Paulius Jankunas (205-84) did not help to save the game for Zalgiris. Brazilian center Augusto Lima (207-91) added 13 points and 6 rebounds. Both coaches used bench players and allowed the starting five to rest. Real Madrid have a solid four-game winning streak. Defending Spanish champion maintains second position with 13-5 record behind leader CSKA, which they share with Olympiacos. Zalgiris lost third consecutive game. Defending Lithuanian champion keep the thirteenth place with 12 games lost. Real Madrid's next round opponent will be Brose Baskets (#12) in Bamberg and are hoping to win another game. Zalgiris will play at home against the league's leader CSKA and hope to win that game. Top scorers: Real Madrid: O.Hunter 14+6reb+1ast, T.Thompkins 12+3reb, J.Carroll 11+1reb+2ast, G.Ayon 11+2reb+4ast, S.Llull 8+3reb+8ast, F.Reyes 8+3reb Zalgiris: A.Lima 13+6reb, L.Lekavicius 11+1reb+4ast, P.Jankunas 11+7reb+2ast, L.Westermann 6+1reb+7ast, E.Ulanovas 4+5reb+1ast, A.Kavaliauskas 4+2reb
No shocking result in a game in Istanbul where eighth ranked Turkish Darussafaka (10-8) defeated 11th ranked Russian Unics Kazan (7-11) 71-64. Unics Kazan was ahead by 1 point after three quarters before a 20-12 charge of Darussafaka, which allowed them to win the game. They dominated down low during the game scoring 50 of its points in the paint compared to Unics Kazan's 28. American guard Brad Wanamaker (193-89, college: Pittsburgh) notched 16 points, 7 rebounds and 5 assists to lead the effort and French Adrien Moerman (202-88) supported him with 17 points and 7 rebounds. Four Darussafaka players scored in double figures. Darussafaka's coach used an eleven-player rotation and allowed the starting five to rest. Even 13 points and 8 rebounds by Belarusian center Artsiom Parakhouski (211-87, college: Radford) did not help to save the game for Unics Kazan. American Keith Langford (193-83, college: Kansas) added 16 points. Darussafaka moved-up to sixth place, which they share with Panathinaikos and Crvena Zvezda. Unics Kazan at the other side keeps the eleventh position with 11 games lost. Darussafaka's next round opponent will be Anadolu Efes (#10) in Istanbul. Unics Kazan will play at home against Fenerbahce and hope to win that game. Top scorers: Darussafaka: A.Moerman 17+7reb+1ast, B.Wanamaker 16+7reb+5ast, A.Zizic 13+5reb, J.Anderson 10+7reb+2ast, W.Clyburn 7+5reb+1ast, S.Wilbekin 6+1reb+1ast Unics: K.Langford 16+2reb+2ast, A.Parakhouski 13+8reb, P.Antipov 13+3reb, O.Johnson 10+1reb+2ast, L.Williams 6+8reb, P.Stoll 3+5reb+8ast
We cannot really consider it an upset in the game between close teams when 9th ranked Turkish Anadolu Efes (8-10) were defeated on the road by tenth ranked Spanish FC Barcelona (8-10) 89-78. Anadolu Efes were ahead by 1 point at the halftime before a 56-44 second half run of FC Barcelona. They shot the lights out from three nailing 15 long-distance shots on high 60.0 percentage. FC Barcelona players were unselfish on offense dishing 21 assists. Brazilian center Vitor Faverani (212-88) notched 18 points and 8 rebounds to lead the effort and Finnish point guard Petteri Koponen (194-88) supported him with 20 points and 4 assists. Even 25 points by American guard Brandon Paul (193-91, college: Illinois, agency: Pensack Sports) did not help to save the game for Anadolu Efes. French guard Thomas Heurtel (189-89, agency: BeoBasket) added 18 points. Both coaches used bench players and allowed the starting five to rest. FC Barcelona moved-up to ninth place, which they share with defeated Anadolu Efes. FC Barcelona's next round opponent will be higher ranked Panathinaikos (#6) in Athens and it may be quite challenging game. Top scorers: FC Barcelona: P.Koponen 20+4ast, V.Faverani 18+8reb+1ast, V.Claver 15+5reb+2ast, J.Carlos Navarro 9+2reb+1ast, J.Doellman 9+6reb+1ast, A.Renfroe 7+3reb Anadolu Efes: B.Paul 25+1ast, T.Heurtel 18+1ast, T.Honeycutt 11+7reb, D.Thomas 8, J.Granger 6+6reb+3ast, B.Dunston 5+8reb+1ast
Bottom-ranked Italian Armani Milano managed to get a fifth victory, breaking the ten-game losing streak. This time defending Italian champion won against fifteenth-ranked Turkish Galatasaray92-87. The hosts were already 11 points ahead after 3 quarters before a 27-21 Galatasaray's run in the last quarter cut the lead to 92-87 at the end of the game. Armani Milano players were unselfish on offense dishing 21 assists. It was a good game for Croatian swingman Krunoslav Simon (197-85) who led his team to a victory with 19 points and 5 assists. Serbian center Miroslav Raduljica (213-88) contributed with 13 points for the winners. Armani Milano's coach allowed to play the deep bench players in such tough game. Sinan Guler (192-83, college: Carroll, MT, agency: 1x1 Sports) replied with 17 points and 6 assists and Uruguayan point guard Bruno Fitipaldo (183-91, agency: Pro Sports) added 17 points and 4 assists in the effort for Galatasaray. Four Galatasaray players scored in double figures. Defending Italian champion (5-13) moved-up to fifteenth place, which they share with defeated Galatasaray. Armani Milano will play against higher ranked Olympiacos (#3) in Athens in the next round and they do not belong to the favorites in that game. Galatasaray will play at home against Maccabi T-A (#13) and hopes to get back on the winning track. Top scorers: EA7 Armani: K.Simon 19+3reb+5ast, M.Raduljica 13+4reb+2ast, M.Kalnietis 12+2reb+4ast, R.Hickman 10+2reb+2ast, M.Macvan 8+6reb+2ast, A.Cinciarini 8+4reb+3ast Galatasaray: B.Fitipaldo 17+2reb+4ast, S.Guler 17+4reb+6ast, A.Daye 14+2reb, T.Pleiss 10+5reb, A.Tyus 8+5reb, V.Micov 7+3reb+2ast
Very predictable result in Tel-Aviv where eighth ranked Serbian Crvena Zvezda (10-8) beat 13th ranked Israeli Maccabi T-A (6-12) 71-67. Maccabi T-A was ahead by 6 points after three quarters before a 23-13 charge of Crvena Zvezda, which allowed them to win the game. Guard Stefan Jovic (198-90) notched 14 points and 7 assists to lead the effort and Bosnian-Serbian center Ognjen Kuzmic (213-90) supported him with 8 points and 9 rebounds. Even 19 points and 5 rebounds by American guard Andrew Goudelock (190-88, college: Charleston) did not help to save the game for Maccabi T-A. His fellow American import forward Victor Rudd (205-91, college: S.Florida) added 11 points. Four Maccabi T-A players scored in double figures. Both coaches used bench players in such tough game. Crvena Zvezda have an impressive five-game winning streak. Defending Serbian champion moved-up to sixth place, which they share with Panathinaikos and Darussafaka. Maccabi T-A at the other side keeps the thirteenth position with 12 games lost. Crvena Zvezda's next round opponent will be higher ranked Baskonia (#4) in Vitoria and it may be quite challenging game. Maccabi T-A will play on the road against Galatasaray (#16) in Istanbul and hope to win that game. Top scorers: Crvena Zvezda: S.Jovic 14+3reb+7ast, D.Thompson 10+1reb+1ast, O.Kuzmic 8+9reb+2ast, B.Lazic 8+3reb, L.Mitrovic 7+4reb+1ast, M.Simonovic 6+1reb Maccabi T-A: A.Goudelock 19+5reb+2ast, C.Iverson 13+5reb, S.Weems 12+1reb, V.Rudd 11+4reb+3ast, Y.Ohayon 7+2reb+5ast, G.Mekel 3+3ast
The game in Istanbul supposed to be also worth to mention about. 5th ranked Greek Panathinaikos (10-8) played at the court of sixth ranked Turkish Fenerbahce (11-7). Fenerbahce smashed Panathinaikos 84-63. The game was mostly controlled by Fenerbahce. Panathinaikos was better in third quarter 17-16. But it was not enough to take a lead and get a victory that evening. Italian forward Luigi Datome (203-87) notched 16 points to lead the effort and Czech power forward Jan Vesely (213-90) supported him with 13 points. Four Fenerbahce players scored in double figures. Even 25 points (on 9-of-11 shooting from the field) by American point guard Mike James (185-90, college: Lamar) did not help to save the game for Panathinaikos. His fellow American import forward Chris Singleton (206-89, college: Florida St.) added 13 points. Panathinaikos' coach gave up on the game allowing to play ten players seeing no chance for a win. Defending Turkish champion moved-up to fourth place, which they share with Baskonia. Panathinaikos at the other side dropped to the sixth position with eight games lost. Fenerbahce's next round opponent will be Unics Kazan (#11) on the road and are hoping to win another game. Panathinaikos will play against FC Barcelona (#9) and hope to win that game. Top scorers: Fenerbahce: L.Datome 16+4reb+3ast, A.Duverioglu 13+4reb+1ast, J.Vesely 13+4reb+3ast, K.Sloukas 12+4reb+3ast, J.Nunnally 10+2reb+1ast, B.Bogdanovic 7+3reb+5ast Panathinaikos: M.James 25+1reb+2ast, C.Singleton 13+2reb, K.Rivers 11+1reb+2ast, J.Feldeine 4+1reb+3ast, K.Gabriel 3+7reb+1ast, N.Calathes 2+1reb+4ast
Russian leader CSKA delivered the fourteenth victory on Thursday night. This time they crushed 10th ranked German Brose Baskets (7-11) 85-64 in Moscow. The game without a history. CSKA led from the first minutes and controlled entire game increasing their lead in each quarter. They shot 60.4 percent from the field and made 20-of-22 free shots (90.9 percent) during the game. CSKA outrebounded Brose Baskets 28-16 including a 21-9 advantage in defensive rebounds. They looked well-organized offensively handing out 26 assists. French Nando De Colo (196-87) scored 26 points and 5 assists to lead the charge for the winners and forward Nikita Kurbanov (202-86) chipped in 10 points and 5 rebounds during the contest. The best for the losing side was Italian Nicolo Melli (205-91) with 15 points and 5 rebounds and Daniel Theis (204-92, agency: Octagon Europe) scored 16 points and 5 rebounds. Since the result was very predictable, it gave the chance for the coaches to test many bench players which allowed the starters a little rest for the next games. Defending Russian champion maintains first position with 14-4 record. Defending German champion Brose Baskets dropped to the eleventh place with 11 games lost. They share the position with Unics. CSKA will meet Zalgiris (#14) in the next round which should be another easy win for them. Brose Baskets will play against the league's second-placed Real Madrid and hope to secure a win. Top scorers: CSKA: N.De Colo 26+4reb+5ast, K.Hines 13+3reb, N.Kurbanov 10+5reb+3ast, V.Fridzon 10+2reb+1ast, A.Jackson 9+2reb+6ast, V.Khryapa 5+3reb+6ast Brose Bask.: D.Theis 16+5reb, N.Melli 15+5reb+3ast, D.Miller 8+1ast, M.Lo 8+3ast, L.Staiger 6+1reb, J.Strelnieks 5+1reb+2ast
Baskonia Vitoria Gasteiz (Liga Endesa) added to their roster 27-year old Argentinian international point guard Nicolas Laprovittola (193-90). He supposed to play at San Antonio Spurs in the NBA, but left the team in Dec.'16. In 16 games he recorded 3.7ppg and 1.8apg this season. The most of last season Laprovittola spent at Movistar Estudiantes where in 20 Liga Endesa games he averaged 13.8ppg, 2.9rpg, 4.4apg and 1.6spg (in top 3). He also played earlier that season for Lietuvos rytas in... [read more]
Baskonia Vitoria Gasteiz (Liga Endesa) added to their roster 27-year old Argentinian international point guard Nicolas Laprovittola (193-90). He supposed to play at San Antonio Spurs in the NBA, but left the team in Dec.'16. In 16 games he recorded 3.7ppg and 1.8apg this season. The most of last season Laprovittola spent at Movistar Estudiantes where in 20 Liga Endesa games he averaged 13.8ppg, 2.9rpg, 4.4apg and 1.6spg (in top 3). He also played earlier that season for Lietuvos rytas in Lithuanian LKL. In 17 games he had 10.3ppg, 2.2rpg, 3.8apg and 1.2spg. Laprovittola also played 10 games in Eurocup where he got 12.1ppg, 4.3rpg, 5.5apg and 1.6spg. The list of the past achievements is quite long as among others he was voted Latinbasket.com All-Brazilian League Import Player of the Year back in 2014. Laprovittola has been also a member of Argentinian international program for some years. He has regularly played for Argentinian senior team since 2011 and previously for U19 National Team in 2009. Laprovittola also represented Argentina at the Olympic Games in Rio de Janeiro (Brazil) last year. His stats at that event were 5 games: 8.8ppg, 1.6rpg, 2.8apg, 1.0spg, FGP: 41.2%, 3PT: 35.3%, FT: 80.0%. Laprovittola's career allowed him to visit three different continents. He tasted the life as pro basketball player in Europe, Latin America and of course North America. Laprovittola has played previously professionally in Brazil (Flamengo) and Argentina (Lanus). On Laprovittola:
A very talented PG, has great shooting range and scoring ability. Has an high basketball IQ, personality and court vision. Can defend hard, and can yet quarterback senior teams with success. Huge upside, even at top level.
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